Tapping Head setup New Post Problem
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Don@Campbell-Gemstones...
Tapping Head setup New Post Problem
Les, I managed to get the spindle index pickup working today. New CNC4PC BOB and some creative wiring to get 5V power to the hall effect and my Tachometer. Now to learn how to setup Mach3 to read the hall effect. I know my wiring is OK, I mistakenly put the pickup on Pin 10 and found as soon as I started the spindle motor, I triggered an EPO. Corrected that but still am unable to get a tach readout. A little investigation on google came up with a long list of things to do, none of which I did, so I've a bit of work to do tomorrow. Hopefully before the day is done, I'll get to try the post mod you did and cut some real threads.
Don
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Don
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Posted by: Don@Campbell-Gemstones.com
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Don@Campbell-Gemstones...
Tapping Head setup New Post Problem
Progress Report
Good news. I have Mach3 reading my spindle speed, and it matches the DRO that I setup on the spindle it's self.
I did a test drawing of four dots and set up a job to tap those four dots.. When I tried to do some air cutting, Mach3 hung on Line 2 of the tap, Turns out when I was saving the different post, windows was appending a version on the name. Mach3 didn't like that comment in the tap file Imbedded comment
N0020 (Post processor: Mach3-tap-dwell(2).scpost) so I changed it to
N0020 (Post processor: Mach3-tap-dwell.scpost) and all was well.
While I don't have Mach actually control the speed, next project, the motor start and speed setting showed in the Mach3 screen and the mach 3 spindle speed matched my tach.
I started an air cut and all went as I expected. I had manually set the speed to 500 rpm and while the z moves seemed a little slower than I expected, it looked OK. I then kicked up the speed to 1500rpm and I didn't really notice a change is Z speed. I then turned off the spindle and re ran the job, expecting that it would hang on the first Z feed after the G95. It didn't, it fed the Z at the same speed as when the motor was running. I am researching Mach 3 setup now to find out what is wrong. I at first though it might be using the 500rpm in the S command vs the index pulse, so I changed it to 1500 but it didn't effect the speed of the feed either.
I suspect that there is a box I didn't check in Mach3 config that is the problem, now to find it.
Don
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Posted by: Don@Campbell-Gemstones.com
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Good news. I have Mach3 reading my spindle speed, and it matches the DRO that I setup on the spindle it's self.
I did a test drawing of four dots and set up a job to tap those four dots.. When I tried to do some air cutting, Mach3 hung on Line 2 of the tap, Turns out when I was saving the different post, windows was appending a version on the name. Mach3 didn't like that comment in the tap file Imbedded comment
N0020 (Post processor: Mach3-tap-dwell(2).scpost) so I changed it to
N0020 (Post processor: Mach3-tap-dwell.scpost) and all was well.
While I don't have Mach actually control the speed, next project, the motor start and speed setting showed in the Mach3 screen and the mach 3 spindle speed matched my tach.
I started an air cut and all went as I expected. I had manually set the speed to 500 rpm and while the z moves seemed a little slower than I expected, it looked OK. I then kicked up the speed to 1500rpm and I didn't really notice a change is Z speed. I then turned off the spindle and re ran the job, expecting that it would hang on the first Z feed after the G95. It didn't, it fed the Z at the same speed as when the motor was running. I am researching Mach 3 setup now to find out what is wrong. I at first though it might be using the 500rpm in the S command vs the index pulse, so I changed it to 1500 but it didn't effect the speed of the feed either.
I suspect that there is a box I didn't check in Mach3 config that is the problem, now to find it.
Don
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Posted by: Don@Campbell-Gemstones.com
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Brian L
Tapping Head setup New Post Problem
Don,
I don’t know a whole lot about Mach 3, but I was under the assumption it doesn’t do G95 in conjunction with the spindle rpm. Now, I just read the “manual” and it says it can, but I don’t think I’ve heard of many getting it to work correctly on a mill. My thought would be to use G94 and program your feedrate based on rpm x pitch. I suspect you will find your Z axis feedrate keeping up as it should then, at least if it’s capable of moving fast enough. A 1/4-20 thread at 1000 rpm is 50ipm and some stepper driven machines don’t move that fast.
Brian Lamb
blamb11@cox.net (blamb11@cox.net)
Weimaraner Rescue of Arizona
www.vswc.weimaraner.com click on "rescue dogs"
On Jun 22, 2014, at 11:27 AM, Don@Campbell-Gemstones.com (Don@Campbell-Gemstones.com) [sheetcam] <sheetcam@yahoogroups.com (sheetcam@yahoogroups.com)> wrote:
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Posted by: Brian Lamb <blamb11@cox.net>
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I don’t know a whole lot about Mach 3, but I was under the assumption it doesn’t do G95 in conjunction with the spindle rpm. Now, I just read the “manual” and it says it can, but I don’t think I’ve heard of many getting it to work correctly on a mill. My thought would be to use G94 and program your feedrate based on rpm x pitch. I suspect you will find your Z axis feedrate keeping up as it should then, at least if it’s capable of moving fast enough. A 1/4-20 thread at 1000 rpm is 50ipm and some stepper driven machines don’t move that fast.
Brian Lamb
blamb11@cox.net (blamb11@cox.net)
Weimaraner Rescue of Arizona
www.vswc.weimaraner.com click on "rescue dogs"
On Jun 22, 2014, at 11:27 AM, Don@Campbell-Gemstones.com (Don@Campbell-Gemstones.com) [sheetcam] <sheetcam@yahoogroups.com (sheetcam@yahoogroups.com)> wrote:
Progress ReportGood news. I have Mach3 reading my spindle speed, and it matches the DRO that I setup on the spindle it's self. I did a test drawing of four dots and set up a job to tap those four dots.. When I tried to do some air cutting, Mach3 hung on Line 2 of the tap, Turns out when I was saving the different post, windows was appending a version on the name. Mach3 didn't like that comment in the tap file Imbedded commentN0020 (Post processor: Mach3-tap-dwell(2).scpost) so I changed it toN0020 (Post processor: Mach3-tap-dwell.scpost) and all was well.While I don't have Mach actually control the speed, next project, the motor start and speed setting showed in the Mach3 screen and the mach 3 spindle speed matched my tach.I started an air cut and all went as I expected. I had manually set the speed to 500 rpm and while the z moves seemed a little slower than I expected, it looked OK. I then kicked up the speed to 1500rpm and I didn't really notice a change is Z speed. I then turned off the spindle and re ran the job, expecting that it would hang on the first Z feed after the G95. It didn't, it fed the Z at the same speed as when the motor was running. I am researching Mach 3 setup now to find out what is wrong. I at first though it might be using the 500rpm in the S command vs the index pulse, so I changed it to 1500 but it didn't effect the speed of the feed either.I suspect that there is a box I didn't check in Mach3 config that is the problem, now to find it.Don
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Posted by: Brian Lamb <blamb11@cox.net>
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Don@Campbell-Gemstones...
Tapping Head setup New Post Problem
Brian, I read a lot of weird stuff today about G95 and Mach3. All the way from best thing since sliced bread to worst idea yet. One thing popped out that caught my attention. It was a comment that once the move had started, it no longer monitored the index, but fed at the speed that was detected when the move started. If I'm remembering that post correctly, it states it is the same for the mill and turn. That would say that if your spindle got sluggish going into a tap or thread cycle, it may well overfeed as the feed was set as soon as the z move started, even though the tap or tool wasn't in the work yet.
This has been an interesting problem.
I was already to test it on some aluminum when I realized I hadn't made a lock for the reverse arm yet. I'll probably get that finished tomorrow and the try to tap some holes.
Don
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This has been an interesting problem.
I was already to test it on some aluminum when I realized I hadn't made a lock for the reverse arm yet. I'll probably get that finished tomorrow and the try to tap some holes.
Don
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Les Newell les.newell@...
Tapping Head setup New Post Problem
Hi Don,
Mach does monitor the index while in G95 but it isn't all that dependable and can only cope with a fairly small change in speed. When it starts a G95 move it first monitors the spindle speed and takes an average over a number of counts. It then works out the feed rate and starts moving. Once it is moving it monitors the spindle speed and adjusts a feed rate override to compensate for any changes.
When used for turning I never got reliable threads even with a machine that had a very stable spindle. I have never tried it for milling. If you have a compression type tap holder it should be close enough. I wouldn't trust it for rigid tapping. I know of one manufacurer that runs a servo motor for the spindle. When you switch to tapping mode their breakout board connects the spindle to the A axis step/direction outputs then does tapping as coordinated Z-A moves. This works very well for rigid tapping.
Les
On 23/06/2014 03:15, Don@Campbell-Gemstones.com (Don@Campbell-Gemstones.com) [sheetcam] wrote:
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Posted by: Les Newell <les.newell@fastmail.co.uk>
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Mach does monitor the index while in G95 but it isn't all that dependable and can only cope with a fairly small change in speed. When it starts a G95 move it first monitors the spindle speed and takes an average over a number of counts. It then works out the feed rate and starts moving. Once it is moving it monitors the spindle speed and adjusts a feed rate override to compensate for any changes.
When used for turning I never got reliable threads even with a machine that had a very stable spindle. I have never tried it for milling. If you have a compression type tap holder it should be close enough. I wouldn't trust it for rigid tapping. I know of one manufacurer that runs a servo motor for the spindle. When you switch to tapping mode their breakout board connects the spindle to the A axis step/direction outputs then does tapping as coordinated Z-A moves. This works very well for rigid tapping.
Les
On 23/06/2014 03:15, Don@Campbell-Gemstones.com (Don@Campbell-Gemstones.com) [sheetcam] wrote:
Brian, I read a lot of weird stuff today about G95 and Mach3. All the way from best thing since sliced bread to worst idea yet.  One thing popped out that caught my attention. It was a comment that once the move had started, it no longer monitored the index, but fed at the speed that was detected when the move started. If I'm remembering that post correctly, it states it is the same for the mill and turn. That would say that if your spindle got sluggish going into a tap or thread cycle, it may well overfeed as the feed was set as soon as the z move started, even though the tap or tool wasn't in the work yet.
This has been an interesting problem.Â
I was already to test it on some aluminum when I realized I hadn't made a lock for the reverse arm yet. I'll probably get that finished tomorrow and the try to tap some holes.
Don
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Posted by: Les Newell <les.newell@fastmail.co.uk>
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Don@Campbell-Gemstones...
Tapping Head setup New Post Problem
Les, thanks for that update. I spent the day on the road between Eye Dr for the follow up and three optometrist to get the replacement lens. Tomorrow is the cut test, but based on what I've seen, and now understand, it should work just fine, IF as Brian questioned a while back, the Taig can deliver the needed power to the spindle. If I can poke some 10-32 threads in aluminum I'll be happy.
Don
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Don
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